Wadzek and ICOC
Written by kingmasada on 2007-07-11 12:24:23
I listened to all 3 lessons and appreciated Mr. Wadzek's thoughts. However I disagree with alot of his thoughts. The lesson seemed to be more about praising the methods of the icoc and alot less about the long lasting effects of the icoc.
Don't get me wrong there is a ton of good to come out of the icoc, but I do believe that the bad
(and the ugly) has clouded the good. Almost with every negative point (bad or ugly) it was quantified with a positive statement and justification for why the negative outcome came. This I disagree with.
The icoc has done a great job of laying down the basic foundation of the faith. They have encouraged a community of people who love each other. They have gotten young people and older people to be committed to the work. Marriages have been saved, addicts are no more, and those in debt are free. For all that good, there is still a huge number. Three fourths of everyone baptized in the icoc has left the church (some are still faithful to God). Some have gone through professional counseling sessions to heal. Some have lost an identity within Christ. Some have become codependent or iconic of its leaders. Some's faith has been irrevocably damaged.
Can we learn from the icoc? Yes. But let's not minimize the negative effects of the methods for the sake of 100 souls. It's too easy to say all churches have problems or weaknesses. Some of these side effects of the icoc methods are not necessary. Don't get me wrong, church growth is important and requires incredible sacrifice (sleepless nights, late night studying the bible, counseling, prayers, building relationship). But you don’t have to look that far (personal conversations, internet testimonies, the exodus of recent years) to see the methods created a sacrifice that even Jesus didn't ask for. And for that some have even lost faith.
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Good Stuff
Written by CIADirector on 2007-07-12 07:28:56
I was at this conference and I felt Bruce did a good job. He was able to pick the good out and not dwell (beat-up) the ICOC to badly over the bad and the ugly. I agree he could have really hit them hard over the bad and ugly, but what good would that have done?
It was good to heal some wounds and move on. |
dialogue needed
Written by pinakidion on 2007-07-14 07:11:42
This kind of dialogue is very much needed in order to bring us together. I appreciate the spirit in which Bruce gave these lessons.
As a member of the ICOC, however, I've found that the methods being praised are not effective long-term. I've also found them, as masada said, to be destructive. As such, I do not agree with Bruce's conclusions.
However, that is the beauty of working together. We can talk honestly and openly about our past, present, and future. Thanks for the links. I hope more lessons like these with other perspectives can start mushrooming everywhere. |
